Stop Requiring Users to Need customizing for basic services

[davidsk]

As a volunteer on SUMO, I am continually seeing requests from users who have never used the config editor or set up userChrome.css. They just want to use Thunderbird for email, but the weird layout with the tool bar and the unprecedented mandatory threading requires that they dig under the cover of the software to make changes just to have a workable email client. This is not necessary. The simple CSS that fixes the tool bar could easily be the default or a menu item, and that also applies to the threading issue. Other email clients, such as Postbox and TheBat!, have all user options on menus, not hidden away in unauthorized CSS modifications. What we have is an email client that needs geek-level tweaks to be useful, and the anger and frustration and annoyance on SUMO is proof that we're on the wrong track if user-friendly is a goal. Fixing this isn't hard; it just requires looking at Thunderbird as a user. Thanks for listening. (To be clear, I am not proposing the elimination of userChrome.css, but I do support having a goal of eliminating the need for it for commonly-requested services, such as what I describe here.)

[davidsk]

I did a test with the clone called Betterbird, and was pleased to find that it automatically places the toolbar in the position preferred by most users, below the menu bar, and also defaults to no threading. That is, no CSS required and no need to edit the config file. This is obviously doable in Thunderbird--easily. The developers are hurting users when they ignore what users keep telling us.

[Papipio]

Bonjour David,

I do agree with you !

I have been using Thunderbird for years, I am now getting very disappointed.

Years ago, I asked with others, for having bugs corrected, but I got nothing corrected.

With the last version 115.2.2, there are evolutions which are completely useless (for main window and address book window), but which introduce regression and several new bugs.

Are the developers of Thunderbird using intensively Thunderbird ? I don’t understand how such a regression can happen. How is the project mastered ?

Sorry, I am not able to participate in the development of Thunderbird …

So I am looking for a new good mail client, Thunderbird is too annoying for me.

Pierre

[Agentvirtuel]

Hello

Take a look https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/thunderbird-115-4-1-what-have-mozilla-done/m-p/45274/high...

[Meem55]

Agreed here!
With 115, Thunderbird has become a whole lot more non-intuitive for the normal users.
It's maybe great if you like to tinker with things and customize but for the normal user who just want a normal intuitive mail program, it's a great step backwards in comparison with 102.

[davidsk]

Along the same line of ignoring users, the recent decision that made the card view the default has caused more posts on SUMO for help. The table view was easy to manage, changing which columns to present and how the message list would be sorted. The card view does neither, causing more user frustration. I am continually amazed at the decisions being made. Making threading the default has been a disaster, and this is just further proof of the isolation in which the developers live. Making the changes is easy, once a person knows where to make the changes, and THAT is never addressed. Maybe it's time to develop a real help file that is easily searched; the many web pages, while good, do not accomplish that.

[Ricchard1310]

Yeah, ironic they called 115 "Supernova". Thunderbird used to be a star, before it just exploded!  It's frustrating for those of us who are just regular users, and not computer programmers, and don't know how to fix it. I have a small screen and now cannot see my emails without opening each in a new tab since I can no longer minimize the message display pane. Sorry after all these years (and donations), but now Thunderbird is just a hassle for me. Will need to find a program where the folks are more responsive to user's needs

[Agentvirtuel]

Hello

I can no longer minimize the message display pane

Unless I've misunderstood
Height of the inbox list view ?
Take a look https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/thunderbird-version-supernova-the-pane-showing-messages-i...

An Untold History of Thunderbird
https://blog.thunderbird.net/2023/11/the-untold-history-of-thunderbird

[jamesroha]

It seems you're having trouble minimizing the message display pane in Thunderbird. For assistance, check your inbox list view height settings. Also, explore the provided links for more information about Thunderbird's history and updates.

Sources by: seoservicesnorthlondon.com/

[Agentvirtuel]

Hello

About, i can no longer minimize the message display pane
For information purposes, take a look https://connect.mozilla.org/t5/discussions/still-no-fix-on-the-message-list-pane/m-p/49983/highlight...

[ThePillenwerfer]

Bang on!

I had to 'upgrade' from TB45 to be able to use OAuth2.  Out-of-the-box 115 was utterly vile.

Luckily I'm enough of a geek to go through the settings, including the config editor, and get it much better and did the finishing touches with custom CSS and now really like it and won't be up-dating it 'til it absolutely can no longer be avoided.